HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by tonyoci » Mon Aug 31, 2009 1:07 pm

I'm not one to judge guitars Ornaith. My 7 or 8 guitars total cost less than Dave's lastest one :)

It's a good guitar, the shape is different and I found it awkward to hold and play sitting down. It's heavy and solid but honestly I just don't pay attention or can't tell the difference in the pickups. I really am a useless plank in that area :)

I said to someone, maybe Dave, the other day that I like Jack White, I like his style, his approach, his "way" but I can't come up with more than two of his songs that I actually like :)
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by criddlerus » Mon Aug 31, 2009 1:55 pm

tonyoci wrote:I'm not one to judge guitars Ornaith. My 7 or 8 guitars total cost less than Dave's lastest one :)
Your Variax had to be at least $500..... ;) I am definitely not one to defend the expensive guitars. After buying one, I am not totally convinced it was worth it. I was just putting my big toe into water to see how it felt to play "better guitars". I have always thought buying the best guitar by a lesser brand was a good way to go. A high end Ibanez may only cost $400 and be way better than a $400 Gibson for example.

What you are comfortable with is key.

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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Grandma Melonhead » Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:19 pm

There is a lot to be said for finding a guitar that really suits you, but that isn't necessarily going to be an expensive one.

My chum Frank has a lot of guitars, including 2 telecasters. One was custom made by hand out of koa wood and originally cost over 2 grand but to me it sounds awful -- well, maybe not awful, but I wouldnt be able to find use for it. His other tele is some obscure copy from the 70s or 80s and even though it sounds nothing like a tele it's one of my favorite guitars ever. I shoulda bought it myself.
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by The Cracks » Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:12 pm

The Cracks wrote: I'm heading to the guitar store tomorrow. I am either going to buy a new pickup for my acoustic guitar, or buy a new acoustic with the pickup built in, or maybe rent one if I can.
Just got back from the guitar store. I bought an Ibanez AEG10E. They all say the going price is $428.00 (as my price tag said), but it seems they are selling for about $284.98 (which is what I got mine for):

Image

I tried to buy a pickup, but for a good one, it cost over $100.00, so I figured why not buy a nice (for me) guitar with pickup and tuner already built in. So I did. :D
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Chris C » Mon Aug 31, 2009 10:23 pm

Another enjoyable show.

Freedom - Nice vibe. At the first couple of 'Freedom's I thought of Richie Havens at woodstock.

Very Small Boy - Love that wacky soukous sounding groove. Not sure about the tone of the shaker. Maybe try sunflower seeds (joke). Fun song. Had me smiling on my commute.

Tiny Pieces - Love that rhythm guitar tone. Nicely done.
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Zoetrope » Tue Sep 01, 2009 6:43 am

ornaith wrote: . . . Slint's "Spiderland" album, . . .
:^: 8) :^:
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by criddlerus » Tue Sep 01, 2009 11:08 am

Cracks - I like the new guitar. There is definitely something to be said for having the tuner and pickup built in. It is always a pain to set up the pickup on my acoustic. However, my Dean Markley soundhole pickup has more of a humbucker sound as opposed the the "under the bridge" pickups, which have a brighter, strummier sound.

Good buy. That will work well for your gigs.
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Zoetrope » Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:57 pm

For those who haven't heard it, here's Spiderland on Youtube.

(Warning: You may not be prepared for music this awesome.)
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Grandma Melonhead » Wed Sep 02, 2009 4:49 am

All strong songs this week again.

Freedom - Michael Lyzenga
Very nice restrained arrangement and excellent vocal.

Very Small Boy - Frank Canonica
Striking arrangement and nice emotion in the song writing. It does remind me of Paul Simon (graceland) as well, not just for the happy African guitars but also for the casual melody approach.

Tiny Pieces - Earnie Bledsoe and Kerry Penley
Clever!

Guitars.
Where are you getting all this buzz on the Rondo guitars? And which ones are the good ones? It seems kinda crazy to buy a guitar without playing it but at these prices...

Edginess
Ornaith I agree with you (and others), that it is nearly impossible to get the kind of energy you get naturally with a band, by playing all the instruments yourself -- particularly at home, but in a studio either. I think that at this point if I wanted to make a serious album, I would arrange the stuff as completely as possible in my DAW and then put together a band just for the recording sessions.
(by the way, how do you pronounce your name? I'm guessing it's OR-nah. ?)

Regarding big emotion in singing, I feel like big emotion is overdone. ITs nice when a huge sweeping emotion put across by a song can sweep you up but it gets tiresome to me when every song is sung that way. I also like songs that are mundane. I guess I'm the same with movies.

25 XTC songs
That's a dream assignment! And the song you put up sounds great (have you ever heard Joe Jackson's version?). What other songs are you doing? Are you finding any particularly tough?

We did a cover of their version of "all along the watchtower" back when I was still a teenager. So it was a cover of XTCs cover of Hebndrix' cover of a Dylan song. shwiew. I have a cassette still of us performing it at the mental institution that my mom worked at. You can hear it here if you're curious. It was quite an experience. The deaf members of the audience were all in front with their arms and heads on the stage to feel the vibrations. My favorite part of the tape is the guy in the audience shouting 1234 before we start. That's me screaming -- I mean "singing". Frank Canonica was playing keyboard.

I was playing my guitar through a black face Fender which of course didn't have a ground plug so I was getting a sizeable shock when touching both the mic and my guitar at the same time. Somewhere during the song I got the idea that, with all these crazy people screaming around us, I should embrace the shock and see how long I could stand it. Maybe I could put the body trauma into my singing. I lasted maybe 2 seconds. Hopw did we all survive our youths? (I remember once doing something very wrong with a pair of headphones that caused them to catch fire on my head).

I'm not posting this song here cause I think its very good. I'm just feeling nostalgic. I guess its a good example of the edginess you get with a band though. I certainly couldn't record this on my own. (Nor would I trash my voice like that these days.)
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by ferret » Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:29 am

Great contributions as always - the opening one was a corker, and Frank C's Paul Simon channeling was almost spooky. Very good.
And I would love to see Alanis Morissette's face as she listened to that one....
Re how to get the edge into your music, maybe change your name to U2? I don't agree with the explanation offered by Toni though - I am drug-crazed and frequently very angry, but my songs are as edgy as a slice of Kraft processed cheese. Dave's age explanation, alas, rings true. Now where did I put me glasses......
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by criddlerus » Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:48 am

Grandma Melonhead wrote: Guitars.
Where are you getting all this buzz on the Rondo guitars? And which ones are the good ones? It seems kinda crazy to buy a guitar without playing it but at these prices...
I think Tony was the one who turned me on to them. There is a forum of people extolling the virtues of their Agile brand http://www.agileguitarforum.com and I have heard repeatedly how great they are. They have a video of a guy singing and playing with the Fabulous Thunderbirds playing one of their gutiars. Tony has several and I have one on order. I will let you know what I think. $99!
Grandma Melonhead wrote: 25 XTC songs
That's a dream assignment! And the song you put up sounds great (have you ever heard Joe Jackson's version?). What other songs are you doing? Are you finding any particularly tough?
We are doing a lot from the first 5 albums. I was just working on Snowman and that was pretty tough. Burning with Optimism's Flames is also a tough one. I seem to have won the honor of learning most of the tricky Dave Gregory solos. The solo in Are You Receiving Me? is also tough. Very fun to play these! We are also doing Vanishing Girl and Little Lighthouse from the Dukes albums. Those are a blast. My favorites are the ones form White Music with all the nasty organ stuff. :)

And yes, I have heard the Joe Jackson version of Statue but it has been a while. It probably sounds like him because I didn't try to impersonate Andy Partridge's nasty British scowl as much. I may try that next time I sing it.
Grandma Melonhead wrote: We did a cover of their version of "all along the watchtower" back when I was still a teenager.
What a wonderful noise! I love the sound and the feel of the band. Yeah, that brought back memories of high school and college shows for me. Just rockin' out. Man, there were some magical moments in there.

Dave
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by tonyoci » Wed Sep 02, 2009 9:23 am

Many people take the Rondo guitars, the $100 one's and use them for upgrades, there's a whole trade in that. Their more expensive $200-$400 guitars are solid in their own right.

Dave is keeping the secret that he has more songs recorded so perhaps we'll get another one this week.
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by chckn8r » Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:44 am

Grandma Melonhead wrote:Edginess
Ornaith I agree with you (and others), that it is nearly impossible to get the kind of energy you get naturally with a band, by playing all the instruments yourself -- particularly at home, but in a studio either. I think that at this point if I wanted to make a serious album, I would arrange the stuff as completely as possible in my DAW and then put together a band just for the recording sessions.
Yeah! There's nothing like a bunch of different musicians interpreting their own part. I remember explaining to my wife what the appeal of live albums - if they're well recorded, then they give you a bit of a glimpse into how the band sounds with that live "edge". Unfortunately, some of the larger acts releasing live recordings overdub some parts in a studio after the concert - I was able to hear Peter Gabriel's Secret World DVD tracks before and after overdubs - it's all nuance, but it's definitely interesting hearing the difference in performances.

I heard stories of Pearl Jam trying to capture that live "edge" in the studio by recording with floor wedges blasting up at them in their earlier records. Obviously, a pain in the a$$ for the recording engineer.
Grandma Melonhead wrote:Regarding big emotion in singing, I feel like big emotion is overdone. ITs nice when a huge sweeping emotion put across by a song can sweep you up but it gets tiresome to me when every song is sung that way. I also like songs that are mundane. I guess I'm the same with movies.
Funny - I was just in the dentist office thinking the same thing re: overdone emotion. Don't know if it was the pain inflicted by sharp instruments heightening my awareness of the easy listening radio station being played, but the Celine Dion wannabe crooners were really getting on my nerves.

I do have to say though, that I find there's a BIG difference in what I think I sound like when I'm singing versus what I sound like when I play it back. I've found that I almost have to really over-exagerate expressions to get them to actually come across in some sort of passable manner. Weirdness abounds.

Can't wait for the next GMH tune - love the stuff you do!

D
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by tonyoci » Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:47 am

GMH. One more thing. Edge is not big emotion, edge is hard to define and may even be the wrong word. Perhaps spark is the right word, just something in the song that makes in more than mundane.
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Gu Djin » Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:09 am

As long as you don't call it the "X" factor, I'll go along with that.

Kind regards
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by tonyoci » Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:26 am

It's the GenerationX factor (they definitely had an edge though I'm not sure Billy does anymore).
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Re: HMHS 171 - Edginess Central (08/28/09)

Post by Gu Djin » Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:38 am

Good lord you are really testing my memory now. I'd forgotten about Billy Idol.

T'anks for the memory
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