Intimidated

Discuss the Zoom H6, H5, H4, H4n, H2, H2n, and H1. Please don't "post and run". Participate in the discussion. Thanks.
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Dawkman
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Intimidated

Post by Dawkman » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:15 am

I am a relatively new user to the Zoom H4 N and I am trying to use it to make some demo recordings which are essentially stereo recordings of my vocal and guitar but I am trying to record the tracks individually because it is hard for me, with my current physical acoustic situation, to properly mix the two tracks at the right levels simultaneously as my acoustic guitar is rather loud physically even though I am using the Piezo electric pickup. Am I better off using the MTR settings or is there a way to record in stereo one channel at a time. I could also use a refresher on how to mix either one of those choices down to a stereo output. I do have some other songs where I would probably want to add a lead guitar track over the rhythm track and still makes it down to stereo and that would have to be done as an "MTR" initially but I'm still not clear on how to mix it down to stereo. I do have some audio processing software (Power Tracks Pro Audio, Cubase Lite, WaveLab) available to me but limited documentation on it and I am concerned that the learning curve will be steep and was wanting to get a fairly rudimentary demo to some people with minimal hassle and would love to be able to do it just from the recorder. Hope someone can help. I have owned this thing for a while but have been rather intimidated by it and it really just starting to use it. I tried the "live" simultaneous stereo recording and didn't have great luck and my guitar overpowered my vocals. :shock:
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Wulfraed
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Wulfraed » Sun Nov 05, 2017 11:00 am

Unfortunately, the H4n manual is one of the poorer translations I've seen from Zoom.

You most likely do want MTR mode... BUT! The H4n can not use both the X/Y microphones and Input 1/2 at the same time (based upon page 56). So to manage a cabled instrument and a vocal track will require the instrument to be in either 1 or 2, and an external mono microphone in 2 or 1 (which ever is not the instrument) [page 56 right hand column, bottom illustration].

You should be able to adjust the recording level independently for the tracks. Make sure to position the microphone so that the instrument is in the dead zone (for common "sticks", aim the handle end where the cable comes out toward the instrument; studio side-address types will require more experimentation), so it doesn't pick up too much of the instrument over the edges.

This will give you two mono tracks (Oh, do NOT stereo link the tracks -- page 60). Besides setting recording levels, you have the ability to adjust the playback level and panning of the tracks (page 59). You might want to do a small amount of panning left/right for the vocal and instrument (putting them slightly on opposite sides, so they don't sound like they are coming from the same place).

Page 123-124 covers bouncing -- after you've gotten the playback levels and panning where you want them, you'd bounce the two mono files to a new stereo file.


ALTERNATE: You can record the instrument using the cable -- only. THEN rewind, set-up the internal microphones on different tracks, setting the instrument track into playback. Monitoring over headphones, you would then provide the vocal -- only.

After that, go to the bounce procedure.
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Dawkman
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Dawkman » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:20 pm

Thanks. I did the original with an external mike and vocal processor but had to play and sing simultaneousle(and do neither well). I will try MTR >Guitar> Vocal> Bounce>Mix. Thanks 4 ur help!!!!
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Dawkman
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Dawkman » Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:01 pm

I know I'm being a bit of a wimp but I am rather intimidated by the "bounce" process and don't fully understand the menu. I have a monaural track of guitar on track one and I panned it a little bit left and I recorded monaural vocal on track to and panned it a little bit right. I just want to make sit down to a stereo file that I can burn to a demo CD. I am not sure if you sequentially bounce files to a third track or do the process one at a time as it looks like you are supposed to hit "execute" and it doesn't seem to specify where the output track is etc. Can someone help?
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Wulfraed
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Wulfraed » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:25 am

You adjust the mix (pan/volume) of all the source tracks to where it sounds right during playback. (Take into account I'm working from the manuals -- the only devices I own that have bounce/master features are the big 8+ channel multi-track decks)

THEN:
Select the bounce operation mode
Make sure it is a stereo file (if you pick mono, panning operations won't have any effect)
Execute

If you want to confirm the bounce, you'll have to deassign the source files, and assign the newly created stereo bounce file to a track pair, for playback. (Or copy the bounce file to a computer for playback)

{On the big multi-track decks, doing a single track (or stereo pair) -> single (stereo pair) bounce is sometimes useful, as it allows applying an insert effect to a track that had been recorded "dry". I don't see anything in the H4n manual to indicate that effects can be applied during a bounce -- you would have to record the track with the desired effect from the start.}
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Dawkman
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Dawkman » Wed Nov 15, 2017 11:03 am

I understand the concept but not sure of the procedure. I have 2 mono files on tracks 1&2. do I somehow link them as a stereo file first or somehow "bounce" them to a 3rd track to create the stereo file? I set panning on the mono files on tracks 1 and to slightly "lateral" but am not sure if this does anything based on what you wrote above. I am trying to make a simple stereo recording from these 2 mono tracks.
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Wulfraed » Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:27 pm

Dawkman wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 11:03 am
I understand the concept but not sure of the procedure. I have 2 mono files on tracks 1&2. do I somehow link them as a stereo file first or somehow "bounce" them to a 3rd track to create the stereo file? I set panning on the mono files on tracks 1 and to slightly "lateral" but am not sure if this does anything based on what you wrote above. I am trying to make a simple stereo recording from these 2 mono tracks.
They are fine as they are. With both 1&2 set for playback, are you happy with the results of the panning? (panning of 0 means the same signal appears in both left and right, 100% L [or R] means the signal only appears in L [or R], anything between means some of the signal appears on the opposite side).

If you are, you leave those tracks selected for playback, and you create a NEW FILE during the bounce operation (select stereo destination). The new file, as I understand the manual, is NOT ATTACHED to any track/pair -- you have to decide what to do with the file after it has been created (since it is a stereo file, you would have to attach it to a linked stereo pair -- and deassign the mono files from the tracks they are on, saving them for any future needs).
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Superscope PSD-300; BOSS BR-600, Zoom HD16cd, Zoom R16, BOSS BR-800, Zoom H2n
Now to (re)learn to play an instrument

Lanikai S-C, SMC-E; GoldTone Banjo-Uke; Flatiron 1C, A5; Big Muddy M1-W; Ovation MM68AX, CSE-44; Orpheus Valley Fiesta FS; Taylor NS-72ce, T5-S1; Musima (4st, 20 fret, tenor-tuned) banjo; bongos, dumbeks, bodhrans, hand drum, tambourine; recorder: soprano, alto, tenor; Cedar Flute (5 sizes); Pennywhistle (3 keys); Casio keyboards

Dawkman
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Re: Intimidated

Post by Dawkman » Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:06 am

Thanks. Panning is good so I will try bounce tonight. appreciate your time, expertise, patience and kindness.
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