Ways to add a third mic to H4N

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Damage87
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Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Damage87 » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:06 am

Hi.

Swedish podcast here. Doing all of my podcasting with the Zoom H4n + 2 external microphones.
However I would like to add another person to the conversations and wish to use the same kind of microphone for this third person.
I'm a complete newbie when it comes to recording and stuff - but I think I have figured out a way.
My question is basicly if it's possible to just add one of these to one of the outputs:

https://www.thomann.de/se/cae_90072_yau ... _kabel.htm

Will I be able to use 2 mics on the same output?

Thanks for reading.

/Robin - Sweden
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Wulfraed
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Wulfraed » Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:57 am

1) What type of microphones are you using? Relatively cheap unpowered dynamics or more finicky phantom powered condensers? I would not recommend if using condenser as the effect on phantom power is unknown.

2) You'll end up with two people on one channel, and one person on the other channel, with no way to "spatially" separate the two.
2b) If one person is rather soft while the other is loud, you won't be able to adjust the gain to level out the two people on the one input.

Podcast is mainly spoken word, where the highest fidelity (music) is not required. I'd suggest something like:
http://www.rolls.com/product.php?pid=MX54s
which can take three XLR inputs (phantom power can be enabled as needed per channel), adjust the input level for each, AND adjust the panning for each -- so you can have everyone spatially separate (yet not be all one channel or the other) and has two XLR outputs to go to the H4n (which can be set to record in simple stereo mode)
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Damage87
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Damage87 » Fri Jun 23, 2017 2:25 pm

Wulfraed wrote:
Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:57 am
1) What type of microphones are you using? Relatively cheap unpowered dynamics or more finicky phantom powered condensers? I would not recommend if using condenser as the effect on phantom power is unknown.
I am using this rather cheap (but quite good) microphone: https://www.thomann.de/se/the_tbone_sc4 ... nmikro.htm
And as I understand it - it's a phantom powered one, right?
So it won't work?

If I get 2 recordings on one channel really dosn't matter - I work my way around that so that it sounds good in the editing.
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Wulfraed » Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:15 pm

It is a condenser and does need phantom power.

Using that splitter means the H4n has to supply enough 48V phantom power to charge both microphones AND you may have cross talk problems (yes, it is still one channel recorded, but as the signal is detected by the voltage/capacitance changes of the element as sound waves flex the surface, having a second microphone in parallel could mean the other absorbs some of the signal as the charge from the second element "pads" the change in the first element).

Using a mixer with panning could reduce the need for post-processing; each speaker can be spatially located in the stereo field with mic gains properly set for each person. (Heh: an R16 in 8X-input mode would allow up to 8 speakers, each positioned [panned] to a different location left to right). Having speakers panned to different locations can make it easier for listeners to keep track of just who is speaking when.
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Damage87
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Damage87 » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:54 am

So a better alternative would be to just get me a Zoom H6 with 4 inputs right? That would work?
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by Wulfraed » Sat Jun 24, 2017 7:36 pm

Given that the R24 (I forgot the R16 only has 2 phantom power inputs) tends to list for $500 at reliable places, and the H6 is around $350 at the same dealers...

Still a bit expensive if you already have the H4n, and only expect to need that third input -- compared to a microphone mixer at around $140. If starting from scratch, with no pre-existing equipment, the H6 would be a viable option.
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Lanikai S-C, SMC-E; GoldTone Banjo-Uke; Flatiron 1C, A5; Big Muddy M1-W; Ovation MM68AX; Ovation CSE-44; Orpheus Valley Fiesta FS; Taylor NS-72ce, T5-S1; Musima (4st, 20 fret, tenor-tuned) banjo; bongos, dumbeks, bodhrans, hand drum, tambourine; recorder: soprano, alto, tenor; Cedar Flute (5 sizes); Pennywhistle (3 keys); Casio keyboards

greenA2
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Re: Ways to add a third mic to H4N

Post by greenA2 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:03 pm

You know you can bypass the internal mics right? Or just use them, you talk about a third person so you could simply point the built in mics towards the third person, ideally with the foam cover on.
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