H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Discuss the Zoom H6, H5, H4, H4n, H2, H2n, and H1. Please don't "post and run". Participate in the discussion. Thanks.
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billbraun
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H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by billbraun » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:00 pm

With the H5 in front of me, centered on the guitar sound hole, the L and R mics show different db levels. All Lo Cut, Compressor, or Limiter settings are OFF. Is this normal behavior?

Thank you,

Bill
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Jim_Fogle » Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:09 pm

I don't know but I would think so. I think you're visually trying to center the microphone. You may have to move the H5 around to determine the exact position where audio is balanced. If possible have a friend listen while you play and determine the correct position by listening. You likely need to move the H5 farther away from the guitar so the sound can blend more.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by billbraun » Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:03 pm

Thank you, Jim. I made an assumption that I do not know to be true, that the XY/LR mics pick up sound predominately from the direction the mic is pointed. So if two players/instruments were facing each other and the H5 was positioned on one side with the L mic pointed at one and the R mic at the other, each mic (L and R) would hear more from one instrument than the other. I realize there will be blending.

Bill
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Wulfraed » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:05 pm

The soundhole may not be the primary source for some tonal/frequency ranges. Sure, air/waves move in and out, but consider that if air is coming out, the guitar body is moving in (and dragging some air with it <G>). Maximum string movement occurs half-way between bridge and fingered-fret; so if playing around the 12th fret, string max may be near soundhole, but if playing an open string, the max will be near the 12th fret.

One reason electrics have two or more selectable pick-ups -- allowing optimization for desired tonal quality.

An X/Y Stereo will, then tend to pick up some differences.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by billbraun » Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:07 am

Thank you, Baron, appreciate the insight.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Wulfraed » Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:44 am

If you really do suspect an imbalance in the H5, you'd probably need to run an experiment using a single (mono) sound source [electric keyboard using an instrument that supports constant pitch/volume -- no chorus/vibrato, feeding just one speaker, or at worst, align the speakers so they aren't "side-to-side" relative to the H5] and a lazy-susan type rotating tray. Center the H5 on the tray and start recording. Hold one note on the keyboard and make a slow 360 rotation of the tray (if you can, take note of the time stamps when it is perpendicular and parallel to the sound source). You might even do this with different notes (A110, A220, A440, A880, etc. for each octave). Then examine the wave forms on the computer.

Ideally, when the H5 is perpendicular (L/R microphones, S speaker):

Code: Select all

L
                           S
R
both L and R channels should show the same levels, and for the parallel case

Code: Select all

L R                       S
(and R L->S) the levels for one channel will match the level of the other channel 180 degrees away (hence the timestamps).

Any offset on the lazy-susan will, of course, result in some variation in levels.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by greenA2 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:58 am

Wulfraed wrote:
Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:05 pm
The soundhole may not be the primary source for some tonal/frequency ranges. Sure, air/waves move in and out, but consider that if air is coming out, the guitar body is moving in (and dragging some air with it <G>). Maximum string movement occurs half-way between bridge and fingered-fret; so if playing around the 12th fret, string max may be near soundhole, but if playing an open string, the max will be near the 12th fret.
That's true if you assume the sound hitting the H5 is mostly coming directly from the string. In fact the string transmits a lot of energy to the guitar top via the bridge. What the O.P is really getting is a cardioid microphone pointing at the guitar top, and one pointing at the fretboard. Of course the top is louder than the fretboard (though what you will mostly get from the fretboard mic is off axis sounds from the guitar top again).

Merry Xmas by the way!
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by denny d » Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:16 pm

I've been using this for voice, and it was fine for a while, but now L and R are not the same. L sounds farther away, less responsive in level and tone. What's the deal with this?
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Jim_Fogle » Sat Jun 02, 2018 7:22 pm

Hi denny d and welcome to the forum. Can you clarify what you mean by "less responsive" and "tone"? How long have you had the H5? Are you using the H5 different than before?
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by denny d » Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:47 pm

Hey Jim, I use it for a podcast, have had for a couple of years, maybe less. Its on a table, with a stand. Two people equidistant apart, just talking. The left side recording, when I listen in Garage Band, sounds like the person is farther away, like 50% of the other level, plus more noise.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Jim_Fogle » Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:49 pm

Okay I understand what you're saying better. Thanks for taking time to respond.

Do you normally use the same chair, table, space to record your podcasts? Do you normally sit to the left side, right side or it doesn't matter? Do you have any external microphones you can use to compare against the internal microphones?

I think a logical next step would be to remove the microphone module to clean and lubricate the connections using a spray on contact cleaner \ lubricant. https://www.amazon.com/CRC-05103-Electr ... B000BXOGNI
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by denny d » Thu Jun 07, 2018 6:21 pm

Hey I will try the spray cleaner and let you know. The set up is always the same. I don't have any external mics right now.
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Re: H5 XY Mics Record Different db Levels

Post by Jim_Fogle » Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:25 pm

Here's hoping the electronics cleaner fixes the imbalance!
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