Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

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verithin
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Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by verithin » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:35 pm

Hi,

I just got my new R16 today and tested it.
The following happens if only two inputs (5+6) are active (Play/Mute/Rec = red) and all other inputs are muted.

Now, only when the red peak LED's of the two active inputs are flashing *at the same time*, then the two neighbouring peak LED's (7+8) are flashing simultanously. This is irritating as it suggests that the neighbour inputs (7+8) are clipping.

I have searched in this forum and in the manual but I could not find anything that would explain this behaviour.

Could anyone confirm that this is 'normal feature' or is my brand-new R16 defective?

Thanks, Klaus

Wulfraed
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by Wulfraed » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:03 pm

First question: What is the setting for Phantom Power at on 5&6?
Second: What is the setting for MIC at on 7&8?

Due to the shared phantom power generator, 5&6 sometimes shows some cross bleed. 7&8, if set to MIC, could be reacting to room noises.

If the relevant tracks are not armed for record, I'd probably consider it an annoyance more than a problem.
--
Baron Wulfraed
IISS Elusive Unicorn (detached)

Superscope PSD-300; BOSS BR-600, Zoom HD16cd, Zoom R16, BOSS BR-800, Zoom H2n
Now to learn to play an instrument

verithin
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by verithin » Tue Jan 03, 2017 7:11 am

Thank you for the quick response.
Phantom Power and the internal MIC are both OFF.

I made another test:
Only inputs 3+4 are now used, all other inputs are muted with gain set to zero.
Now, if the Peak LED'S of 3+4 are flashing at the same time, the neighboring LED's of 1+2 will flash as well.

However, this only happens if an neighboring odd and a even input are flashing at the same time: If the LED's of 4+5 were flashing together, no other LED's would be flashing simultanously.
And it does not make a difference if any tracks were stereo-linked or not.

Annoying indeed: This behaviour makes a reliable peak control of 1+2 impossible.
The good news: monitoring track 1+2 proved that no audio signal of track 3+4 was bleeding in.

Firmware is 1.21.
Could you doublecheck if your own R16 shows this behaviour as well?

Thank you, Klaus

Wulfraed
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by Wulfraed » Tue Jan 03, 2017 7:32 am

<sigh>

A week ago, I'd have had no problem finding time for such a test... Unfortunately, the company Christmas break is now over and I need to get back into that work. No idea of when I'll have free time to dig the unit out.
--
Baron Wulfraed
IISS Elusive Unicorn (detached)

Superscope PSD-300; BOSS BR-600, Zoom HD16cd, Zoom R16, BOSS BR-800, Zoom H2n
Now to learn to play an instrument

hoodoo voodoo
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by hoodoo voodoo » Tue Jan 03, 2017 10:23 am

I also experience this phenomenon, across several pairs of inputs...if the incoming input level (irrespective of the gain knob) is high enough to activate the peak lights. If the 'other' channels are not activated for recording there is no audio bleed across to them. If the 'other channels are active and recording, there is also no audio bleed into 'unwanted'channels. So it's just an indicator fault, due to shared circuit architecture of some sort, but it has no practical implications for crosstalk etc. Annoying..but not functionally bothersome or crippling

mikethebass
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by mikethebass » Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:38 am

I'll try have a look on my own machine as I'm finally getting round to starting recording a new album.

A question for the OP. Are your tracks set to mono or stereo link?

verithin
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by verithin » Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:08 am

Thanks for your feedbacks.

@ hoodoo voodoo : Can you confirm that this only happens if you use a odd and an even pair of inputs (i.e. 3+4 or 5+6) ? This means using 4+5 will not show this behaviour even if they are peaking at the same time.

@ mikethebass : Thank you for spending the time and trying this out. To reproduce this behaviour it does not make a difference if any tracks are stereo-linked or not. Curious about your feedback!

----------------------
The fact that this behaviour has not been reported before (as far as I know) makes me wonder if it only occurs with newer production batches.
It would be helpful if a owner of a older R16 could give us a feedback as well.

Thanks, Klaus

Paj
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by Paj » Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:51 pm

I routinely have to use in-line 12dB pads for keyboard and wireless mic signals. The input attenuators on the R-16 obviously don't/can't cut the input signal to zero. I got my HiZ pads from naiant.com

Paj
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Wulfraed
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Re: Peak LEDs flashing even if gain is set to zero

Post by Wulfraed » Mon Feb 13, 2017 7:26 pm

Paj wrote:
Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:51 pm
I routinely have to use in-line 12dB pads for keyboard and wireless mic signals. The input attenuators on the R-16 obviously don't/can't cut the input signal to zero. I got my HiZ pads from naiant.com

Paj
8^)

The R16 is based upon consumer line-level (nominally -10dBV). If your keyboard et al. are using professional line-level they are nominally +4dBu. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_level

The pro-gear has signals peaking four times the voltage of consumer gear (and since the inputs need to amplify microphones, line level [gain control all the way to minimum] on Zoom assumes the maximum it sees is around half a volt.
--
Baron Wulfraed
IISS Elusive Unicorn (detached)

Superscope PSD-300; BOSS BR-600, Zoom HD16cd, Zoom R16, BOSS BR-800, Zoom H2n
Now to learn to play an instrument

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