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R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:08 pm
by sjon
Hello.

I've had an R24 since November, but I've only used it sporadically. The first few times it worked fine. Last time, however, it froze on the start-up screen, the one that says "Ver= 1.12 ZOOM". I switched it off and on a couple of times and it seemed to right itself.

Today I turned it on again, after a couple of weeks without using it, and the same problem, except this time it didn't go away. I restarted at least 10 times, then on the 11th it suddenly started normally. I imported some files to a project via USB, but then when I went out of USB mode it froze again. I turned it off, tried to restart, another 5 attempts, same start-up screen thing and I gave up.

I e-mailed the seller and the distributor (I am in Spain). Let's see if they respond.

In the meantime, has anyone else had this problem?

Thanks,

Simon

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:53 pm
by sciurius
Probable causes may include:
- bad power supply (did you try with a differente power supply? With fresh batteries instead?)
- bad SD card (try booting without)

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 3:50 pm
by sjon
OK, thanks. I'll try those solutions.

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 9:46 am
by sjon
Right, it seems to be a problem with the card. It starts without the card, and it starts (showing "PRJ 000") with the card from my R8. However, my laptop reads the R24 card fine.

I was about to go out and spend €12 on a new power supply, but now I'm in doubt.

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:26 am
by Wulfraed
Considering the unit can be powered from a DC adapter, USB (when used as card reader/control surface/audio interface -- I don't know what a pure high-output USB power supply [charger] does), and from batteries -- if it behaves the same with pretty much any power source, I'd go after the SD card as the first line of attack.

I'd say copy off anything you want to keep from the card, then use https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter/ to reformat the card (use the OVERWRITE option, and if it is enable, the CHS adjustment). A quick format only wipes the File Allocation Table and resets the block bit-map; overwrite will actually zero every available block of the card and might detect if the card has bad sectors.

And, CLASS 4 or 6 is all that is needed, and may (at one time at least) be better. Class 10 cards were rated for streaming video -- that is, ONE FILE in continuous read or write on a freshly formatted card. Class 2/4/6 were rated for smaller files and handles fragmentation better (still image cameras with some images deleted). Since the unit creates a separate file for each track in use, that means lots of parallel smaller files are being accessed. A cheap Class 10 may only be able to keep the FAT and one data block "open" at a time -- reopening a "block" to append data really means finding a free block, erasing it, copying the existing data to it, and then appending... EACH time the "file" changes. Higher end cards can keep multiple data blocks "open" in parallel, resulting in less block reallocation/copying. Allocation blocks are multiple MB in size, so just changing even a project file (which is only a KB or so in size) recycles MBs of space.

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:13 am
by sjon
Solved. I made a copy of the R24 card, formatted it, reloaded the files and now it works fine. Thanks!

Note: I hadn't seen the previous post when I wrote the above, so I just did a quick format, but I will bear it in mind if I have any more problems. Thanks again!

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:03 am
by hoodoo voodoo
Wulfraed.....following on from your formatting advice, would formatting the SD card within the Zoom itself, using the onboard 'Format' command, be as effective ( or less so) as formatting in the computer using the full overwrite method that you've outlined above ?

Is formatting within the Zoom perhaps on a par with the 'quick format' utility from the sdcard.org folk .....and less effective than a complete overwrite using that same utility ?

Re: R24 freezes on start-up screen

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 5:57 pm
by Wulfraed
The device may still try to format the card just because it doesn't find the basic directory structure, or it may just create the directories.

Main thing is if SD Formatter offers the CHS adjustment (it has a check box for it, but none of my recent uses had it enabled). What that does is attempt to change some meta-data so the device is optimized for "cylinder/head/sector" type access (LBA access may not matter). And the overwrite format should access every block on the device so if it is failing something might be detected, or mapped out of the bitmap.