What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Questions and answers related to any Zoom Gear that doesn't have its own sub-forum yet. This includes any new gear that's been announced, and any old gear you've got. Please don't "post and run". Participate in the discussion. Thanks.
NucleusX
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What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Wed Feb 05, 2014 2:50 am

So. The past 2 years or so we've seen the ZFX4 equipped G series
slowly progress up to the G5 as the most feature packed iteration.
I've read rumors about a G8 possibly being in the future works
but all it is, is a rumor, and one I hope that might be true.
Personally, I love the G5 and would love to see this expanded
further into a more featured unit with more switches/expression
full stereo send and return fx loop, twin tubes, much like a
G9.2TT. Surely the G5 isn't the end of this G series ?
One thing that frustrates me about Zoom the past few years is
that they are dragging the chain on MFX products and firmware
for guitarists because they seem to spread their resources thin
across parallel projects like the apple and recording/video
products which is all well and good but it slows things down for
us serious guitarists that don't care for all those other gimmicks.
Did they really need to release the G1on ? I mean, look at it, it
looks cheap and nasty and a complete waste of more time seen as
tho Zoom already have a few current value versions of the G series.
I'd love to see them focus back onto MFX in a serious way
again, may it be a much anticipated flagship after the G5 or
even a rack mount version which they haven't done in a LONG
time and I would personally jump on it if it ever came to fruition.
I'd also love to see the Zoom MultiStomp range expanded.
I'm sick of refreshing Zoom's webpage waiting for significant
updates for guitarists and my emails NEVER get responded
to, so I thought I'd come here and try to start a discussion
about this in a general sense with all you axe grinders.

What's your thoughts ?
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 1:54 pm

agree completely with the G1on / G1Xon, they look very Fisher Price!

i too love my G5, although being a rhythm guitarist, i will never stretch
it to its extremes. it does what i need with the minimum of fuss.

yeah, more input / output options would be good on a future iteration of
the G series :)
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NucleusX
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Mon Feb 10, 2014 1:12 pm

lol yeh inputs, I thought it interesting that they implemented
an auxiliary input on the G1on/G1Xon but completely omitted
it on the G5. Not sure what they where thinking there. :nuts:

As for DSP, I can max out the G5 easily with direct chains but
for the price, 9 slots is good enough so Im not complaining.

Be nice if Zoom where a bit more forth coming with their
plans and interact with their customer base to some extent.
Guess we'll have to settle for the dark-horse face of Zoom.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Tue Mar 04, 2014 1:38 pm

i'd also like to see the option of saving looper stuff to an external drive / SD, and then being able
to retrieve it as and when required, rather than just relying on a 60 second "clip".

would be useful when creating new songs... :)
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Fri Mar 07, 2014 11:53 am

That's a good idea, the Digitech Jamman looper uses that feature.
Another is loadable IR's and SPDIF for re-amping a dry signal and
implementing the 96khz standard for better amp-sim definition and
general overall output quality, their 44khz standard is getting old.

Zoom impressed me yesterday when I checked their homepage, they
added 20 amp/fx units in one hit for free on their StompShare store.
Not really highly sort after modelled units, but free none the less.
Promotional prices have finished, now its $2 for FX, and $4 for amps.
Im betting they will start to release the highly sort after stuff now.
Last edited by NucleusX on Thu Nov 13, 2014 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Fri Mar 07, 2014 12:24 pm

shame the G5 can't updated like that too....

used my G5 in a rehearsal last night, working on a new tune with the bass
player and drummer. lead guitarist couldn't make it due to working.

not too much of a problem i thought, i'll simply record the intro bit with
the looper and play live over it to simulate 2 guitarists.... maaan, what
a bind. probably a combination of me being old (and a bit thick - heh!!) but
hitting patches / stopping the looper was painful. it's no-where near quick
enough, what with having to press and hold buttons.

a new G series really ought to have instant access to patches / banks etc
to make playing live (especially when using the looper) a more streamlined
experience. at the moment, it feels very disjointed, but then again, that might
just be me :)
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:29 pm

I wouldn't say it was you. I've read simular complaints about the G5.
Zoom used to be well known for their fast & seamless patch changes
in their past ZFX3 equipped models, not sure bout their loopers tho so
I cant compare. I think the biggest problem I've noticed with the G5
is its switching scheme. 5 switches aren't enough IMHO and when one
of those switches is dedicated to the tube booster, you lose a switch.
Then they compensate that with dual switching having to step on 2
switches or hold 1 switch to conjure other functions and whatever.
Not really a good design if you need it for live use where speed is a
priority, its too cumbersome and better left to a studio enviroment.
The next G series flagship should address that and more hopefully.
As for loading the G5 with new stuff like the MS-100BT, they really
should make this a global feature on ALL their units, not just it.
Would invite a lot more traffic to their StompShare store.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Sat Mar 08, 2014 11:55 am

yeh, stepping onto two buttons is very hit and miss. say i want to
change down a patch, if i don't hit the buttons right, i get the tuner!!

definitely needs dedicated patch up / down buttons like some of its
competitors and instant access to tuner / looper / home functions.

can't complain too much tho, what do we expect when the G5 is 2/3rds
of the price of the Boss GT-100 or the POD-HD500!!
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:45 pm

Yeh, pricewise your right, here in Australia the difference is almost half $330 AUD.
Even the years older G7.1ut is STILL being sold here, and still costs more that the
G5 but I would put them in direct comparison, like I would with the G9.2TT and
the next release which will see a simular price to the G9.2TT I'm guessing.
The price, the features, and the past, suggests to me that there HAS to be a bigger
flagship on the way eventually if Zoom as a company is healthy and still on the ball.
I own a Line6 POD HD Pro (rack mount) now because I got impatient waiting on
Zoom for their next flagship and I don't regret it, it has its weaknesses but i was
able to off-set that using my Zoom gear in its signal paths. I prefer Zoom for FX
but the POD HD Pro takes the stage for amp sims which the Zooms lack in fidelity.
If Zoom released a rack mount unit out I'd be in heaven and put the 2 together.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Sun Mar 09, 2014 10:08 am

rack mount would be good...

it seems that the "multi fx" units like the G5 are on the decrease, i read a lot about
guitarists not liking the digitised tone of them (boss and pod also), with a lot of people
hankering for the old analogue sound... this is especially evident when a BOSS Metal Zone
pedal is fetching approximately half the price of a G5!!

in the early nineties, i used to use a Marshall JMP-1 pre amp and Valvestate 80-80 power
amp into a 4 x 12, that was a fantastic combination for good old chugging thrash / metal!!

i'm seriously considering getting another JMP-1 for nostalgia's sake :)

i'll keep the G5 though as i'm soon to start recording a new tune, and want to hear what
sort of tone i'll get through a decent mixing board with a proper sound engineer!!
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Sun Mar 09, 2014 6:58 pm

Ahh the old *digital vs analogue* debate.

Not so many years ago, I would've been on the hard-core side of analogue gear
to the end knowing that there was no substitute for the genuine tube rig in all its
glory. This debate has even been part of the guitarists journey since the invention
of the transistor, and solid-state amps and I would still place the transistor inferior
(as many people would) to the tube. Transistors, although some-what cold and
lacking the warmth of the tube, provided a new way of looking at the electronics
approach, and modernization of the entire platform we use today.
Key drivers being, power, efficiency, size, robustness and cheap mass-production
all pointed towards to the transistor's inevitable debut. Then, we started to see
hybrids of the 2 technologies, where, you had a tube pre-amp, and a solid-state
power-amp which was supposed to be a happy medium of the 2 technologies.
The 3rd and most recent technology, is largely based on transistor technology,
but, is in a class of its own because of the fact that it uses software and algorithms.
These days, I'm not so *tube hard-core* anymore believing that, even tho this
technology was obviously inferior to begin with, has now come a LONG way in
not only bringing its own unique practicalities to the world, but is also nearing a
faithful re-creation of the tube simulation, it is only now DSP processors are
becoming powerful enough to process the complex algorithms required to *fool*
the ears into a more transparent result, and will improve in-time as sheer DSP
performance increases. DSP processors in many ways, still scales with Moore's law.
Once we cross that threshold well and truly, I believe this technology will render
the tube virtually obsolete as the need for its hardware presence will no-longer be
required and advanced algorithms taken their place. But, I believe there will also
be that old die-hard niche minority, that will keep it alive.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Mon Mar 10, 2014 3:31 am

interesting times indeed.

i currently run my G5 thru' an iPod dock at home, which consists of a subwoofer
and a pair of tweeters.

for rehearsal i run it through my Marshall AVT150 (combo, tube pre-amp, transistor power amp)
which produces "acceptable" results. i tend to leave the amp / cab sims on in the G5 and run
thru' the clean channel of the AVT, dialling the bass / mid / treble EQ's to 12 o clock (5) which
seems to negate most of the amps influence on the G5's sound.

ideally, i would like to try the G5 thru' something like an electro voice powered PA speaker or
a keyboard / acoustic amp. these options should let the zoom "shine" without any amp sound
discolouration.

what hardware do you run your G5 thru'?
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NucleusX
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Mon Mar 10, 2014 3:33 pm

The past few years, with all that in mind from my last post, I decided
to step away from the traditional amp & cabinet approach, because I
was looking into a home studio setup that was practical in ALL modes
rather than just a rig for guitar, so I looked into the FRFR standard.
My full size rack is the nexus of where everything else connects to and
consists of my HD Pro, a mixer, and a few post FX units as-well as a
rack mount solid-state 200 Watt RMS x 2 rack amp which is connected
to a pair of PA's each consisting of a 15" woofer and horn tweeters.
They are full-range and for those times I wanna crank it up, but not
quite the flat response you would expect from say a set of monitors,
so I bought a pair of them which I have connected to my home theatre
amp and PC for DAW and recording purposes, which my rack ties into.
The POD HD Pro acts as my main PC interface and operates @ 96khz
sample rates, so it was in my best interests too maintain my entire
signal chain within it, to preserve its high quality sample rate.
Things like my Zoom pedals and post FX get put within its FX Loop.
So yeh, FRFR is the way I'm heading, and everything else plugged
into the mixer gets sent to full range speakers, rather than the limited
bandwidth you would get stuck with in a traditional guitar amplifier.
Last edited by NucleusX on Mon Mar 10, 2014 4:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Mon Mar 10, 2014 3:53 pm

:D cool!

so, the FRFR speakers you're using are passive, hence the 200W amp?

i've also been looking at an active speaker (preferably an EV ZLX15P - approx £400GBP) for my
recording and gigging needs.
have you used yours in a live gigging scenario? if so, how do they compare to traditional
guitar amps / cabs?

as i probably mentioned, i'm very new to the "digital" age of music, so hearing from
other users their experiences with differing set-ups is very interesting!

thanks for your input, it's much appreciated :)

Ste
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NucleusX
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Mon Mar 10, 2014 4:12 pm

Yep, Passive speakers with a separate amp.

The FRFR standard is a bit of a curve-ball to anyone that's new to it.
All the presets and patches you've written with your existing amp will
no doubt sound like garbage because of the change in frequency range
and you will need to dial them back up from scratch on the G5.
There's a few ways to use them as-well when considering guitar tones.
Wether you use a direct chain approach or one with amp sims in the
path will greatly alter the result, so the room for experimentation gets
a bit more complicated, but a lot more options at your disposal.
I think in FRFR mode, you'll become more reliant on amp sims to
bring back that familiar tone you've always known, so it takes time
to sift through all your parameters till you find your spot-on tone.
Might seem a little daunting to begin with, but trust me, all that
extra flexibility can be alotta fun and enable you to cover MANY
different tonal characteristics your traditional amps simply cannot do.
I think this flexibility is most appreciated in a live and recording
sense, so in many ways, its a step forward, and not backwards.
Other band members like keyboardists, who have full-range/stereo
requirements are easily patched into your setup via mixer/speakers.
Or it can make a badass stereo HiFi system for you to practice with.
I remember I could make some pretty solid metal tones on the G5 as
a direct chain without amp sims so amp sims aren't exactly mandatory.
Metal is what I play %90 of the time so I've had a decent stab at it.

*for rehearsal i run it through my Marshall AVT150 (combo, tube pre-amp, transistor power amp)
which produces "acceptable" results. i tend to leave the amp / cab sims on in the G5 and run
thru' the clean channel of the AVT, dialling the bass / mid / treble EQ's to 12 o clock (5) which
seems to negate most of the amps influence on the G5's sound.*

Just to add to this, if signal colouration is what your trying to avoid
then it would be best to bypass your amp's pre-amp entirely, and
route your G5 output(s) straight into your amp(s) FX loop return.
Some parameter tweaking will be needed but usually gives the best
results, and does not *colour* the signal that comes before the amp
because the signal is not being passed through the pre-amp first.
Be careful with initial volumes, if you don't have an FX loop return
volume control, you will be controlling master volumes on the G5.

Just to make things even more interesting lol, the POD HD Pro
not only has amp sims and cab sims, but, pre-amp sims as-well
so you can mix and match well know pre-amps from well known
amps, with other well known amps, as-well as mixing the cabs.
So for example, I could use an ENGL Fireball pre-amp, with a
Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier amp, and what-ever cabinet after that.
Digital modelling still follows the traditional analogue rules that
you have known all these years so running an amp sim and cab
on the G5, and then outputting it through to the front-end amp
input will be like stacking 2 amp sims in-line with each other and
will no doubt sound terrible. There's also the 4 cable method (4CM)
which gives you the best of both worlds, but you must still remember
these rules when constructing your signal-chain in your G5.

General rule is.

If your running an amp sim before your amp, use its fx loop return.
If your NOT running an amp sim before your amp, use its front-end input.

Sorry for the large post lol, its a pretty broad type
of subject so theres lots to remember here.
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ste_p0270
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by ste_p0270 » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:38 am

yeh, thanks for that... good read indeed.

i'll have a bash with mine tonight thru' the FX loop, see if that gives a better sound.
i don't want to have to change my amp and spend more money unless i really have to.
(wifey starts to take offence when i buy guitar stuff and not spend money on DIY!!)

lot of info to digest there, many thanks for taking the time to write such a comprehensive
reply, it's much appreciated :)

atb,

Ste
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NucleusX
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Re: What on earth will be next Zoom ?

Post by NucleusX » Tue Mar 11, 2014 6:48 pm

No problem.
In many cases, there's changes you can make to your existing rig, rather
than laying out good money for something new. It's worth looking into if
your current needs are mostly met with what you already have.

I don't see much traffic happening here compared to other forums I visit.
Is it just me, or this forum moves REALLY slow ? lol...
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