Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Questions and answers related to any Zoom Gear that doesn't have its own sub-forum yet. This includes any new gear that's been announced, and any old gear you've got. Please don't "post and run". Participate in the discussion. Thanks.
Nhoj
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Re: Zoom Gn series Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:09 am

NucleusX wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:21 am
Nhoj wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:12 pm
NucleusX wrote:
Sun Sep 09, 2018 5:39 am
Doubt it. I believe trails are deeply dependant on hardware limitations. Firmware alone couldn't resolve this.
why is that the GFX4,GFX8, 3000 and 8080 have it even though they have past DSP?
Not sure you quite understand the bigger picture here. Trails isn't a standard thing you should expect from
every multifx pedal just because its new or recent tech. It's more like a premium feature (like an FX Loop)
that comes and goes over the years in various pedals or models, and usually in the higher tiers, because
they are the most likely unit to possess the required amount of extra DSP resources to host trails. On the
odd occasion a lower tier model might get trails, so it's not as simple as tier placement sometimes. Either
way, once a multifx pedal is released without trails, it's highly likely it'l stay that way for good.

It's also usually something you can research in the published specifications and features, prior to purchase.
Zoom 3000, 8080, GFX4 and GFX8 is a old past model and have old dsp with Seamless Delay (trails), the new have more powerful new DSP why does the new models doensnt have that and why Zoom removed it?
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NucleusX
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by NucleusX » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:10 am

DSP doesn't scale like that. Yes DSP processors have become more powerful over the years, but the FX algorithms
have become more complex as-well, requiring the extra DSP resources. The signal is of a higher quality and sampling
rate aswell, eating more into DSP. That DSP load balance hasn't changed much over the years when considering all
company products in general. We still get around 8 - 10 simultaneous FX on common flagships after all these years.

I don't know what you hope to achieve here. I see you posting the same repetitive stuff about trails all over random
subject threads here. The Zoom community can't make it happen for you, we can only discuss it at best. Best you can
do is send your request to Zoom via support email and prepare to wait indefinitely for it. I really think it was your responsibility
as a consumer to know the features of what you're buying. Would you have bought it if you had known then ? If you did
know, why did you buy it if trails is that important to you ? You could've had trails had you chosen another product.
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Nhoj
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:37 am

NucleusX wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:10 am
DSP doesn't scale like that. Yes DSP processors have become more powerful over the years, but the FX algorithms
have become more complex as-well, requiring the extra DSP resources. The signal is of a higher quality and sampling
rate aswell, eating more into DSP. That DSP load balance hasn't changed much over the years when considering all
company products in general. We still get around 8 - 10 simultaneous FX on common flagships after all these years.

I don't know what you hope to achieve here. I see you posting the same repetitive stuff about trails all over random
subject threads here. The Zoom community can't make it happen for you, we can only discuss it at best. Best you can
do is send your request to Zoom via support email and prepare to wait indefinitely for it. I really think it was your responsibility
as a consumer to know the features of what you're buying. Would you have bought it if you had known then ? If you did
know, why did you buy it if trails is that important to you ? You could've had trails had you chosen another product.
Its the Seamless Delay that old zoom have , the seamless delay function have delay trails between patches

btw do you work for Zoom , from what your answering to me , you seem have a lots of info about that, honestly i dont know thats why i ask.and

Btw i did not bought my Zoom G3Xn its a gift for me , if your reading my other post which your not youll know.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:46 am

When someone gave me G3Xn as a gift, my interest to Zoom got back , seems no one really knows here why Zoom didnt include that Seamless delay

thank you
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NucleusX
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by NucleusX » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:17 am

This "seamless delay" just sounds like a Zoom-exclusive label for standard old trails. Is there something it does
other than the garden variety patch trails others seem to have ? Because to me they sound like the same thing.

No i don't work for Zoom, but i have been a guitarist for over 20 years and always been a gear nut.

My mistake, i forgot you said it was a gift, i didn't re-read the entire thread before i posted, just last posts.

Nope, no-one knows, and probably never will, but Zoom just might put it back in the next series, who knows.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:46 am

NucleusX wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:17 am
This "seamless delay" just sounds like a Zoom-exclusive label for standard old trails. Is there something it does
other than the garden variety patch trails others seem to have ? Because to me they sound like the same thing.

No i don't work for Zoom, but i have been a guitarist for over 20 years and always been a gear nut.

My mistake, i forgot you said it was a gift, i didn't re-read the entire thread before i posted, just last posts.

Nope, no-one knows, and probably never will, but Zoom just might put it back in the next series, who knows.

No worries mate! for me its really useful for songs and music parts that i dont want to cut the delay when switching patches and banks, but its me, for sure maybe other people dont care about it.

Yes puting it on the next series is the closest answer we will have for sure.

Also im ready to the next series because my patches memory is close to full, wish the next model have extra memory for patches and features
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Beatnick
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Beatnick » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:09 pm

Really I probably only need about 10 patches for my own music. Clean, crunch and lead are almost always the first 3 I create. Usually I also create a blues, acoustic, fuzz and metal patch as well. Each individual patch has their own effects that can be turned on or off as needed. I have a handful of songs that don't fit into any of the above patches so I have to create separate patches for those. The rest of the patches are just fluff. Usually specific songs or artists I grab off the internet. To be honest extra patches just give me too many choices that distract me from actually playing because I tend to go through every patch and play around a bit instead of concentrating on a song I might be working on.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:30 pm

Beatnick wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:09 pm
Really I probably only need about 10 patches for my own music. Clean, crunch and lead are almost always the first 3 I create. Usually I also create a blues, acoustic, fuzz and metal patch as well. Each individual patch has their own effects that can be turned on or off as needed. I have a handful of songs that don't fit into any of the above patches so I have to create separate patches for those. The rest of the patches are just fluff. Usually specific songs or artists I grab off the internet. To be honest extra patches just give me too many choices that distract me from actually playing because I tend to go through every patch and play around a bit instead of concentrating on a song I might be working on.
We have many songs on our repertoire song list , sometimes in one song there is 3 to 5 patches.

Honestly we have two hundered plus song on our repertoire.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Beatnick » Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:56 am

I tend to use the same basic sound in my songs and I don't really do cover songs so having patches that sound like specific artists is not as important to me, they're just there for fun. I try to do any changes within the patch, not going from patch to patch. I can understand why seamless delay is important if you change patches during the song.
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Beatnick's personal YouTube channel

Beatnick's Odyssey can be found on
CDBaby YouTube Spotify Amazon Apple Music Google SoundCloud
Feel free to search your favorite streaming site if it's not listed. I do not know all the ones I was put on.

Zoom equipment I currently own
G3n, G3, R8, PS-04, 508, 505 II

It's only music, don't take it so seriously

Nhoj
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:18 am

Beatnick wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:56 am
I tend to use the same basic sound in my songs and I don't really do cover songs so having patches that sound like specific artists is not as important to me, they're just there for fun. I try to do any changes within the patch, not going from patch to patch. I can understand why seamless delay is important if you change patches during the song.
Yes theres even songs where i change 3 harmonized patch , and the seamless delay would be a awesome addition to the next update.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Beatnick » Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:46 am

It might be harder to do seamless delay between patches now because you have more freedom within the patches. The older units had a structured order that the effects were in so they pretty much knew the processing power bring used from patch to patch. Now you can pick and choose any effect you want and put them in any order you want. It might be harder to do seamless delay when you are going from a patch that's only using 60% of the processing power to a patch that's using 98%. Or if you are going to a patch with no delay at all, that might make it more difficult too.
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Beatnick's personal YouTube channel

Beatnick's Odyssey can be found on
CDBaby YouTube Spotify Amazon Apple Music Google SoundCloud
Feel free to search your favorite streaming site if it's not listed. I do not know all the ones I was put on.

Zoom equipment I currently own
G3n, G3, R8, PS-04, 508, 505 II

It's only music, don't take it so seriously

Nhoj
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Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:28 am

Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:35 am

Beatnick wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:46 am
It might be harder to do seamless delay between patches now because you have more freedom within the patches. The older units had a structured order that the effects were in so they pretty much knew the processing power bring used from patch to patch. Now you can pick and choose any effect you want and put them in any order you want. It might be harder to do seamless delay when you are going from a patch that's only using 60% of the processing power to a patch that's using 98%. Or if you are going to a patch with no delay at all, that might make it more difficult too.
Yes plus the gaps also will be a problem, that what im thinking thats why they are having hard time to do it takes a lot of dsp maybe.
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:48 pm

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stubbsonic
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by stubbsonic » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:50 pm

It would be great of manufacturers listened to passionate users of their products. I actually think they do. But they also have to bear the cost of the development that is required to make those functions happen.

As we mentioned, there may be a limitation to the hardware architecture that makes it impossible. OR, if it was easily done, they would have done it.

I hope that Zoom does release an update to the Gn series that provides seamless patch changes. But it is still pretty unlikely.

Yamaha used to make a breath controller, a "BC-3" (I think). They discontinued it a long time ago, but it has seen kind of a resurgence. People sell disgusting old ones for $300 on eBay. There was a petition for Yamaha to produce them again. Maybe 800 or so people signed it. Yamaha doesn't even know how to make them anymore. The people who made them are long gone. I contacted them for info, and there wasn't anyone who know anything about the BC-3. It's dead dead. Even if Yamaha wanted to make one, I doubt they could.

OTOH, Kurzweil releases a product and does dozens of updates on their software. They add powerful new features and their users are like, this product is much better than the one I bought, and it IS the one I bought!!
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Nhoj
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Thu Nov 29, 2018 5:56 pm

stubbsonic wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:50 pm
It would be great of manufacturers listened to passionate users of their products. I actually think they do. But they also have to bear the cost of the development that is required to make those functions happen.

As we mentioned, there may be a limitation to the hardware architecture that makes it impossible. OR, if it was easily done, they would have done it.

I hope that Zoom does release an update to the Gn series that provides seamless patch changes. But it is still pretty unlikely.

Yamaha used to make a breath controller, a "BC-3" (I think). They discontinued it a long time ago, but it has seen kind of a resurgence. People sell disgusting old ones for $300 on eBay. There was a petition for Yamaha to produce them again. Maybe 800 or so people signed it. Yamaha doesn't even know how to make them anymore. The people who made them are long gone. I contacted them for info, and there wasn't anyone who know anything about the BC-3. It's dead dead. Even if Yamaha wanted to make one, I doubt they could.

OTOH, Kurzweil releases a product and does dozens of updates on their software. They add powerful new features and their users are like, this product is much better than the one I bought, and it IS the one I bought!!
Image
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stubbsonic
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by stubbsonic » Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:25 pm

Well that's cool, Nhoj. Fingers crossed!!
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Nhoj
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Re: Zoom Gn series Seamless Delay/Reverb Trails/Tails between patches and banks

Post by Nhoj » Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:10 pm

stubbsonic wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:25 pm
Well that's cool, Nhoj. Fingers crossed!!
Yes
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